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I am about halfway through this podcast and just wanted to comment how much I'm enjoying it. I'm finding the tips about showing respect to people who disagree with you so helpful. Especially loved the story about your Black student and her Confederate flag flying friend.

I have a lot of Trump supporting family members who are always trying to bait me into political debates, which tend to get very heated very quickly. It's exhausting and so frustrating. After each conversation I'm beating myself up over things I should have said...you're absolutely right that it's hard to think clearly and rationally when the flight or fight part of the brain takes over. The tips to remember to breathe during these convos and to ask lots of questions from a point of trying to understand (rather than debate) are so helpful. I go into every one of these discussions thinking I need to "win," and always come out feeling angry and frustrated, as do my family members. I'm so glad I subscribed to Persuasion - been looking for a website like this for ages.

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Excellent. Everyone needs to listen to this. Thank you.

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Thank you, thank you for having Irshad on your podcast. To me, she has been one of the best "finds" on this journey to figure out a way for polarized individuals to engage in difficult conversations. Removing the zero sum game aspect of the whole interaction is key. To do that you have to be intellectually and emotionally curious but if the "rules" are predetermined against that curiosity (debate, orthodoxy, etc.), to what I am seeing, you are only going to get more of the same. Irshad gives us hope of the "and" - we do not lose our identity when we engage in tough conversation and we actually see the "other" as a human first.

Regardless - to Yascha's point about how we inject these lessons into Persuasion, my suggestion would be to have Irshad (or someone similar) model this approach with individuals who have VERY devote perspectives on given issues. The point would not be to tell folks they are wrong but to better understand how they came to these perspectives, to better understand their experience and learn about the why. It will be "dangerous" and "provocative" but we need to see it modeled. This is a very distinct skill that we all would do better to learn more about which makes us more effective in understanding our world and, yes, gives us a possible route to persuade.

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My high school senior's thesis topic is on confronting the cancel culture. Is there a transcript for this podcast available anywhere? Thanks!

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Outstanding podcast, I took notes, and I hope it comes up for discussion during our happy hour. She makes it sound easy but in reality it's not. IE, not everyone is willing to play by her rules. But great ideas!

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founding

Listening to this interview, I was reminded of Daryl Davis, a Black musician who's befriended over 200 Klan members who since left the Klan as a result. I especially wonder what their first conversations were like. I can't help thinking that, if they could see enough humanity in each other to have that first conversation, the rest of us should be able to find a way, too. Or at least to want to. I'm glad people like Manji are actually trying to do that concretely in the world.

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